Anglo-Methodist

Anglo-Methodist

Something that I have said almost dogmatically the last several years is that, “everyone has a tradition, the question is do they recognize it or not.” Part of this is because I grew up in a theological landscape where there was usually an outright denial of any tradition, while simultaneously being controlled by traditions. But because they were not acknowledged, it was more dangerous because the driving force was invisible. 

Acknowledging our backgrounds and traditions is important because it provides clarity to ourselves and to others where we are coming from, what presuppositions we are making, and how we process or understand information. As I have undertaken my theological journey over the last several years I have done an equal amount of reading, talking to others and praying. Seeking out where do I fit in the large tent of orthodoxy that is found in the Church universal that affirms the Apostle’s Creed etc…

I find myself through the Lord’s leading in the Free Methodist Church. A denomination that has a shared heritage in the Methodist and Holiness movements. I have grown to love my Free Methodist identity. While we are a Kingdom people, acknowledging we are but one facet in the greater body, we have distinctives that make us unique. And yet, I have also felt a certain pull and draw. While I am in, and love the FMC, it is for the most part a denomination that is generic contemporary evangelical (with growing charismatic leanings) in its expression of worship and theology. Yes, we do have our distinctives outlines in the Free Methodist Way, but on the ground most things look and operate like most other churches.

While we certainly must pursue unity and working together, this at times does come at the expense of important distinctives. I know pastors and lay-people, that while affirming the FMC’s position on the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist, are in practice and casual discussion almost Zwinglian and memorialist in their actual understanding. This likewise carries over to understandings and practice of baptism as well. While certainly not primary Gospel issues, it is certainly distinctive that is at a loss in many places.

I am Methodist in my theology, and am thankful for that. John Wesley is an exemplar of embodying a holistic approach to classical theology that is grounded in Scripture, alive in the Spirit and pastorally useable to shepherd God’s people. In my Wesleyan Theology class at seminary, the book Responsible Grace, by Maddox is an excellent primer that lays out Wesley’s theology in a somewhat systematic way. Wesley was a unique blend of traditional Western Christian theology, with a strong undercurrent of the eastern Church fathers and Eastern Orthodoxy that can be seen in what we now call Methodist theology.

But that has led my to ask a further question. What made John Wesley who he was? I think more often than not, we put the cart before the horse. We examine the outgrowth of Wesley’s ministry in the Methodist movement, and the theological heritage spawned that has certainly changed the world (for the better in my estimation). And yet, is that enough? 

I have more recently come to the conclusion that to properly understand the work that the Lord did through John (and his brother Charles), we must come to a deeper understanding of the Anglican heritage that formed and shaped him, and that he remained a member of his entire life.

Yes, we are all compelled and encouraged by John’s Aldersgate experience where he felt his heart strangely warmed. His Fetter Lane experience where he was empowered for the Methodist revival. We love to talk about the excitement of how God used him to transform England, and the rest of the world through his preaching. But that is just the fruit on the tree. We cannot forget to look at the trunk so to speak.

This is why I now consider myself an Anglo-Methodist…if that’s even a thing.

I am Methodist in my theology. I understand the proper application of the quadrilateral, am greatly informed by Wesley’s sermons & hymnody (John & Charles), and know that Christ is calling us to entire sanctification, where we are made perfect in love. Yet, this Methodist understanding is not a house unto itself. It is built on something older that we often don’t think of. Methodism in its own right as a movement is an outgrowth of Anglicanism. The precepts of Wesley’s understanding were wholly Anglican. With a few exceptions and modifications, the foundational articles of religion for Methodism were that of the Anglican Church. 

The English expression of Christianity always had a unique flavor to it as it had been disconnected from Rome for some period of time before being brought back in following the fall of the Roman Empire. This is why during the reformation, while the situation that led to it’s separation was the monarchies desire to annul a marriage, the theological differences had already made the path to separation from Rome more likely to happen in the Isles. There is so much that can be said, but that would be outside the scope of this article. There are many articles, videos and books that cover the Anglican background and tradition that was the foundation of John Wesley’s life.

Another key aspect of this process has been the involvement of the Book of Common Prayer (BCP). First introduced to me on my trip to Israel by some trip-mates who were ACNA, the BCP has become an integral and core part of my personal spiritual devotion, and is the form of worship at the church I am pastor of. 

The language of the BCP, its prayers and liturgies have been the second largest influence on the English language after the King James Bible. The BCP was the centerpiece of spiritual discipline for Wesley aside from the Bible. In John’s sermons, the quotations of the Psalms are not from the 1611 KJV, but from the Coverdale Psalter, an older English translation of part of the Bible that is found in the 1662 BCP. At Fetter Lane, when the Holy Spirit fell in a special way, it was the Te Deum Laudums, a historical canticle of the Church that is found in the BCP that the group of those gathered sang in unison as response to the work done in that moment. 

As Methodism made its way to America, John produced a volume titled, “The Sunday Service of the Methodists”, which was for all intents and purposes a slightly modified BCP made for the Methodist movement. Even to this day, the traditional service order found in the United Methodist, Free Methodist, and other hymnals and service books is a BCP prayer or Eucharist service with a few changes. 

So for myself, while Methodism is the core of my theology, and understanding of the Christian faith, I have found it to be augmented and modified with an overtone of the tradition that formed its founder. The discipline, flow and beauty of the Daily Office is in various ways shaping my personal devotion. Participating weekly in celebration of the Lord’s Supper utilizing elements that Wesley himself would have been familiar with and utilized has been encouraging and brought life to my walk with Christ, and Lord willing for my congregation. In a constantly updating and changing world, the stability has been grounding and restful.

So what does all of this mean for us today? Well first, we are not just standing by ourselves. Our heritage is found within the Anglican tradition. It formed and shaped the Wesley brothers, and we would be remiss to not acknowledge, or at least understand where we have come from. For all my brothers and sisters that are connected to the Wesley’s, my ask is simple. Come to understand and appreciate the religious foundations that underpinned the Methodist revival. This doesn’t mean you have to use the BCP, ascribe to the 39 Article of Religion, or practice liturgical worship. But it means we should have a functional understanding of the framework of spiritual discipline and life that Wesley lived in. As we continue to pray and seek God to work afresh in the Methodist movement, part of what we must rediscover is where John himself started and work from there into whatever He has for the next generation. 

Intellectualism or Fool?

Intellectualism or Fool?

Recently I was accused on intellectualism by someone I have always looked up to.

In the background/tradition I was raised, one of the worst things to be called was intellectual. It meant that you were now, rather than “relying on the Holy Spirit to be revealed truth”, simply falling prey to the decptions of reason.

What is amazing about the name that I had now been given (again, a title resvered for those obviously not aligned with the Holy Spirit) was because of 1 phrase, from a single paragraph on a Facebook post I had made about baptim, that included a statement that allowed for infant baptism.

Sadly, without any further discussion, investigations or questions to myself, I was now labelled in a way that in the world I grew up in would strip me of any legitimacy because it would be known I no longer touted the party line.

Here is really where we run into the error of contemporary fundamentalism.

Fundamentalism histocially as a philosophy in Christianity came about in response to the raoid liberalizatiom that took place in many parts of the Church in the late 18th & 19th centuries. Famous responders like Machen called faithful Christians to the fundamentals of the faith.

But what has come about, especially in the last 100 years is a difficult thing to reckon with. A good friend of mine often says, “fundamentalism has a pathological need for certainty”. What has transpired in the last century is the tranaformatiom of movement that was responding to the errors of its day (such as the social gospel), has become a self protective silo often dosconnected from the rest of the Church in thought and tradition.

Now, this person who messaged and accused me of intellectualism I consider a brother in Christ. He loves the Lord, and the Church, and I only have the greatest love for him because he has been an example of Christ.

Yet, the theological and philisophical framework he inhabits (what I grew up in) has no tolerance or understanding for anything outside of its frame of reference. I would primarily tie it to the fundamemtalist underpinnings of the Latter Rain movement of the late 1940’s which if derived from.

In my own personal journey I am in a very different place than I was. While I am unchanged in the core Gospel message found in the Apostle’s creed, my positions on a good many things have changed and shifted. Not because I’ve decidely become intellectual. Frankly, it’s because of those who are much smarter and closer to Christ than I am (both spiritually and historically).

As the theologian Thomas Oden, more often than not look to the Early Church Fathers. Because they represent the earliest time to the life of Jesus, a number of them being disciples of the original apostles, what they have to say is very compelling.

Because of this focus, I now hold to theological positions that are looked down upon at best, if not written off as ignorant and not faithful (real presence in the Eucharist & infant baptism to name two). And yet, the consistant witness of the Church catholic through history beckons me, and is farore compelling than a British Bible teacher who has been dead for over a decade (if you know, you know).

To my brother in Christ who messaged me. Reach back out. Take the time to chat with me. There is no ill will, just a desire to talk and come to a common place of understanding. My goal isn’t to be intellectual, never has been. Im just a fool for Christ.

Bible Study before Theology

Bible Study before Theology

nce becoming a lead pastor I have been working on and developing my sermon preparation process. It’s important like anything to work on. Between having a family, working another job and other activities life is busy, so laying out  my process has become an essential to keep on track, One thing that does aid my process is the use of the Revised Common Lectionary (RCL). Week over week, I am able to look at what scriptures are coming up, and in line with what is going on in the liturgical church calendar, it helps frame my preparation. 

I do have a weekly schedule of my sermon preparation available on my website. Feel free to check it out, and I hope it is a blessing to you.

I love theology. The study of God has always captivated me. Looking at the variety of theological positions, discovering development throughout Church history, and how we got to where we are today is fascinating. But As I have come through my seminary studies, and through other reading I have been confronted with a reality. Just knowing theology is not enough, Why? Because at the end of the day, theology, or systematic theology is the end product of studying Scripture. This is where Biblical studies comes in. 

When looking at God’s Word you must, must, must understand the context and background of what we are reading. Language is a hyper-contextual thing. In our day and age we know the difference between a butt-dial, and a botty-call (excuse the crass reference, but it makes the point). We know the difference, but archeologists in 300 years may be debating whether or not those two phrases mean the same thing. That’s what we are doing when we come to Scripture without knowing what is going on. 

Our culture is very very different from that of the Bible authors, especially in the American west. When I lived in Africa on the mission field, a class about Leviticus was being taught. When asked how many students had butchered an animal in the past week, I would say every single hand went up (except mine). It’s apart of their every day life, and when a similar class was being taught in the US that I was apart of, not a single person other than the teacher and myself had every processed an animal. That’s a huge gulf of cultural difference, and that’s only in one small area of life.

When coming to the Bible, this means we need to approach with a lot of humility. We cannot just “read the plain meaning” most of the time because that presumption is charged with the hetty pride that we can understand everything.  What I am not saying is that someone cannot read Scripture without extra tools and receive the core of the Gospel to be saved. What I am saying is that as we delve deeper without an understanding of what is going on contexually, it has, can, and does lead to problematic theological conclusions because of a wrong presumption of the text. 

This doesn’t mean that every pastor, or person who studies Scripture (hopefully every Christian) needs to become an archeological expert. But what it does mean is we need to know WHAT to look for and HOW to look for it. 

A prime example of this is looking at the Genesis creation account. We need to remember that Genesis, and especially the creation story is a theological work, describing work and character of God in contrast to the pagan deities of the surrounding nations. Yes, there are many similarities between the Genesis creation account, and creation accounts found in other Ancient Near Eastern (ANE) creation accounts (such as the Enuma Elish, or the Gilgamesh Epic). But it is in the differences that we see what is going on. The Genesis creation account stands apart on several key points. One of the most important is the idea that all humanity is created in the image of God. Human equality is something presumed in our modern world, was not the case in ancient times. In the other pagan nations, only the kings were in the image of God, and this origin came them the right to subjugate and rule as they saw fit. In these other creation accounts, across the board humanity was either an accident, or through deception.

In contrast to this, the Genesis creation account describes the intentional creation of ALL humanity in the image of God. A massive difference from every other creation story. But we can only see and appreciate this difference if we understand the context of what is going on in the world at the time of writing. This is just one example of many that demonstrate the importance of correctly grappling with the context of Scripture before making theological conclusions (such as strict 6-day creationism). 

 There are 2 primary resources that I have been using are a study bible, and a 2-set commentary set.

 The first is the NIV Cultural Backgrounds Study Bible. This study Bible is a fantastic resource. Everyone should have a good study Bible. I would recommend this one as a candidate. It is chalk full from beginning to end with notes, articles, illustrations & images of everything you need to get started in understanding the background context of Scripture. At around $30 for the basic hardcover, it is hard to go wrong for anyone. Here is a more in depth review of this resource from Disciple Dojo. 

The commentary set is the IVP Bible Background Commentary. This two-volume commentary set provides deeper notes and context about what is going on. Actually, the two primary editors of each volume (Walton & Keener) are the primary contributors and editors of the NIV Background Study Bible. If you are a pastor, student, or someone who needs to get to that next level, this commentary set is invaluable. One of the best parts about each volume are the extensive references that can open up a world of deeper resources and writings and other scholars which aside from the fantastic commentary, make this set worth it. And, being only a two-volume set is very reasonable to acquire. 

Theology is important. Don’t get me wrong, I will always love the study of God. But we musn’t forget that before we can do good theology, we must do good Bible study to understand the background and context of what is going on in the text that we receive the truth from. 

The Book of Common Prayer, the FMW & Love-Driven Justice

The Book of Common Prayer, the FMW & Love-Driven Justice

Justice is the concept of things being right, or as they should be. This means ultimately that things are aligned with God’s character and intention for that thing. One time when I was driving my car it all of a sudden lost all electrical power. The engine still ran, but things were not working as they should. After taking it to the shop, it turned out that the bracket holding the alternator had broken, and because of this there was no electricity being generated. To remedy this a new bracket was installed and the car ran great! (until it got totalled in an accident just a few months later). When things are put as they should be, things operate correctly.     

This principle works on a larger scale as well. Our world has a lot that is wrong with it. Sin has wrecked havoc on not just persons, but on the planet itself. We are broken, lost and in need of help; physically, emotionally & most importantly spiritually. This core concept of love-driven justice is not just a key distinctive of the Free Methodist tradition, but of the Gospel itself. Through Jesus, the world is being put right by His work on the cross, and the subsequent process of His church operating in the world through the power of the Holy Spirit.

As Kingdom people, we are called to be conduits of God’s justice in the world. To be workers who operate in, and towards God’s good intention for His creation. This means acting justly towards other persons, living creatures & the planet. The challenge with this is of course with everything else that we often confuse and syncretize the way of the world with our well-intentioned pursuits. And yet, with God’s help, we will be agents of God’s Kingdom, representing a truly just way of living in our world.

The Book of Common Prayer is a transformative tool in our worship in regards to the concept of love-driven justice. As we have already spoken of, the concept of confession before God and extending peace to our neighbor is front and center. We must first always realize our own need for God’s love and grace to be transformed from our brokenness into the fullness of life that is only found in Him.

Secondly, the Book of Common Prayer through a variety of prayers and canticles calls us from where we have encountered Christ (through His Word, and in the Sacrament), to go into the world,

And now, Father, send us out to do the work you have given us to do, to love and serve you as faithful witnesses of Christ our Lord.” – Post Communion Prayer

We must always have this two-fold perspective  if we are to correctly extend God’s justice in a loving way in our world. We must always remember our need for His help, and then we can be empowered and equipped to extend that to those around us. The BCP provides not just the words, but the framework to understand that process in our own lives. When we fail to do this (as we all have done), we begin to put the cart before the horse, and the culmination of God’s justice through the work of Jesus Christ in His death & resurrection becomes a bludgeon by which we clobber others into our picture of what everything is supposed to look like.

Rather, love-driven justice is a call to walk humbly, and act through the ultimate work of justice, which was our atonement through Christ on the cross. Any version of justice that never offers absolution represents injustice because there is an implicit denial of Christ’s final sacrifice for all. At the same time we must also hold to the reality that the work Christ does is us and does not stay in us. That work is done so that we go out and do the work He has called us to. Being His hands and feet in our communities extends His truth, love & justice to those who need it the most.

Almighty God, you created us in your own image: Grant us grace to contend fearlessly against evil and to make no peace with oppression; and help us to use our freedom rightly in the establishment of justice in our communities and among the nations, to the glory of your holy Name; through Jesus Christ our Lord, who lives and reigns with you and the Holy Spirit, one God, now and for ever.  Amen. – Prayer for Social Justice, BCP 2019

Church Isn’t For You

Church Isn’t For You

I’m going to say something unpopular.

Church isn’t for you (or me).

Yes, it certainly is beneficial and essential for us. But what happens at service is not ultimately about us. It is about Christ. While we are instructed by the word, encouraged by the worship, and fed by the sacrament, the purpose of our time at worship is for the proclamation of the Gospel, and focus on giving praise and honor to God.

Sadly, what we see in a lot of the modem Western Evangelical Church is a specially curated experience that is attuned and created for those experiencing it to draw them, almost in a sense of entertainment. “We need to do stuff so that people will be interested in participating”.

The worship of the One, True, & Living God from the beginning of Scripture is presented to us as for Him alone. We are prescribed how He is to be worshiped. And as we see in Scripture, whenever human ideas of how this worship is to be conducted is implemented, bad things happen. (See Nadab and Abihu, Uzzah etc…)

What I’m saying here is not simply a case for more traditional worship (though it could be made). Ultimately, adaptations, advancements & modifications do happen through the ages in worship. But what should always remain the same is the effort and focus of our worship. My goal in this discussion is not to perpetuate the “worship wars”, but to begin a discussion about the WHY of what we are doing, not necessarily the WHAT.

All of this is being said, not to bash or to question the motives of people. I genuinely believe what we see around us is well-intentioned. People want to see lives changed through an encounter with the Risen Christ. And that’s a good thing! But, we seem to be in a position in many places where the means have ultimately become the ends, and that is always a dangerous thing. This can happen in traditional spaces as well. Where the tradition, and focus on it becomes the goal, rather than it bringing us to closer relationship and transformation in Christ. So this cuts both ways.

Since the 1980’s in earnest, many have adopted the “seeker sensitive model” where the primary motivator behind the movement and flow of services, and the operation of the individual church was to draw in the potential seeker. Sadly, what this created much of the time was repackaged entertainment, spiritual ted talks, and corny attempts to dumb down the beautiful and historic truths of the faith into a modern, often secular-materialist gospel that anyone would consume.

As the Church has continued down this path, the offspring of this move has much of the time been a shallow, no-cost walk with Jesus that can flake away at the first sign of resistance. Following Jesus costs us something…really everything. But when we walk in to commercialized, production intensive, watered down worship experience; while the emotion is high, often the foundation isn’t laid for life-long sanctification that is held fast through every ebb and flow of life.

I know much of what has been said is in many way generalizations, and doesn’t capture every spectrum that is reality in the wide world of American evangelicalism. But if there’s one thing that I have begun to realize is that Gen Z, and potentially Gen Alpha desire is not platitudes and entertainment; they desire foundational, unchanging, & transformational worship & teaching that reaches into the depth of the human experience to answer the burning questions of the brokenness of this world. Rather than answering the question of, “what can Jesus do for me?”, they want to answer, “what can I do for Jesus?”

Our worship, sermons & everything we do much reflect this. We cannot just glide along as things have always been. Jesus doesn’t just make us better. He makes the dead alive, and transforms us into people originally intended to transform creation through abiding and deep relationship with Him.

How we worship is also important. We can never forget that what we do on Sunday matters. We are not just getting together to learn about Jesus. When we gather to worship we are glorifying God, and that worship is looked at by those in the spiritual realm (1 Peter 1:12). Worship is not for us, it is for Christ alone. When we sings songs, listen to the sermon, pray together, recite the Creed, and take the Eucharist together (the last two on the list that sadly to not happen enough), it all forms us to look more like Christ as we worship Him.

What we worship forms us. It always does whether we realize it or not; and that matters.

Yes we benefit from it. During our times of worship and hearing the word we are instructed in what is true, and yet all of it is to truly worship and glorify the One, True God.

Let us worship Him in Spirit and in Truth.

The Book of Common Prayer, the FMW & Live Giving Holiness

The Book of Common Prayer, the FMW & Live Giving Holiness

Integrating the 2019 Book of Common Prayer (BCP) with the Free Methodist Way offers a unique opportunity to blend the rich liturgical traditions of Anglicanism with the dynamic, mission-focused ethos of the Free Methodist Church. This integration can enhance spiritual formation, deepen worship experiences, and strengthen the church’s mission. I am going to use this same opening paragraph in this series of articles on the BCP and the Free Methodist Way. I will then end the series with my comprehensive case for those of us in the FMC to embrace that liturgical tradition and practice of the BCP in any number of ways as the foundation for our desire to see a Spirit fuelled movement.

The first aspect of the Free Methodist Way (FMW) is that of Life Giving Holiness. The short definition from fmcusa.org is, “GOD’S CALL TO HOLINESS was never meant to be a burden, but a gift that liberates us for life that is truly life by delivering us from the destructive power of sin.”

The FMW’s emphasis on Life-Giving Holiness aligns well with the BCP’s focus on spiritual discipline and formation. The BCP’s daily offices, such as Morning and Evening Prayer, provide a structured rhythm of prayer that can help Free Methodists cultivate a life of holiness. These offices include readings from Scripture, prayers of confession, and intercessions, all of which can deepen one’s relationship with God and foster a holy life.

In our culture we often hear the word holy, and automatically revert to thinking about rules, legalism, and towing the party line. But that is sadly an often-too accepted, myopic and perverted definition of holiness. At its simplest, to be holy means to be set apart or distinct. And that by definition is who God is. There is no one like Him, not even close. By any definition or classification it is impossible to be like God because He is perfectly unique. He transcends all boundaries that we could conceive. 

God’s holiness is also unique and powerful. Just like anything that gets close to the sun is burned away, anything that is not like God would be destroyed. Not by some malevolence or desire for violence, but simply because it cannot withstand the power of his unique differentness. (This definition, while simple, gets the general just). And yet, God desires relationship, for His creation to be formed into a reflection of His character, so that we can have a deep intimate relationship with Him. And ultimately, this formation into His likeness is what it means to be truly human. As image bearers of God’s image, means that if we truly want to “be ourselves”, as is the mantra of this current age; then we in fact do it by looking like our creator. 

It is ultimately out of the relationship that God desires holiness. Not just as a list of rules that we follow or we go to hell. But instead as the loving and caring instruction of the one who knows us best, and that to do anything other than that actually brings harm to ourselves and those around us.

This is the call of the Christian life. Living lives of repentance that transform us into His image. As Methodist’s we believe in entire sanctification. A teaching that simply means, through the work of the Holy Spirit, our affections can be fully aligned with God’s love and will. It does not mean we can’t sin, or won’t mess up. But what it does mean is that we become to the greatest extent possible in this life like Christ.

This call to holiness is not a curmudgeonly focus on the rules for the sake of it. But a call to an active life-giving relationship with our creator who desires us to live in the full potential of our humanity as we are transformed to be like Christ.

Now, here is where the Book of Common Prayer (BCP) fits into this. Public and regular confession is a regular part of the services and prayers contained in the BCP. In the modern evangelical imagination, we only think of confession when we have actively done something wrong or we think, “that’s something Catholics do!” In reality, the act of worship in corporate confession has been a part of the Protestant experience since the reformation, and sadly has been largely lost. 

Something happens when we regularly confess our faults, foibles and ultimately our sin. It allows us to be humble, and circumspect in our lives. Remembering our need for God’s grace and forgiveness. This, in turn, if a part of a living relationship with Christ can be a major catalyst for the development of life giving holiness. We are reminded of His perfection and how it works our in our hearts. 

From the Renewed Eucharist Liturgy in the 2019 BCP:

Most merciful God, we confess that we have sinned against you in thought, word, and deed,by what we have done, and by what we have left undone.We have not loved you with our whole heart;we have not loved our neighbors as ourselves.We are truly sorry and we humbly repent. For the sake of your Son Jesus Christ,have mercy on us and forgive us;that we may delight in your will, and walk in your ways,to the glory of your Name. Amen.

This solemn prayer of acknowledging our sin is then followed by:

Almighty God, our heavenly Father, who in his great mercy has promised forgiveness of sins to all those who sincerely repent and with true faith turn to him, have mercy upon you, pardon and deliver you from all your sins, confirm and strengthen you in all goodness, and bring you to everlasting life; through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen.

We are not just left in our sin, but we are reminded of the forgiveness that we have in Christ! That is the power of regularly acknowledging our sin. Not dwelling and sitting in them, but understanding that we are in constant need and reminder of His saving and transforming work in our lives.

So for Life-giving Holiness, the BCP provides to us the tools, disciple and foundation for allowing the sanctifying work of Christ to not just take root, but thrive in our lives. I hope you will join me as we continue to look at the BCP and the Free Methodist Way, and how they can work together to ignite the Holy Spirit in us for the work He has for us!